GOOD GUY'S GARAGE

[FuzzFace2]

As nice as that looks I would never use it in a working garage.

Look up Yale & Towne Manfg. fire Stamford CT.
This building had wood floors soaked for years with machine oil.
1 spark is all to took to bring down this building.

Now if you want to have an office in 1 corner and do the floor in it then go for it but a work in garage give me cement!
Dave ----

[Ray Cecil]

FuzzFace2 wrote

As nice as that looks I would never use it in a working garage.

Look up Yale & Towne Manfg. fire Stamford CT.
This building had wood floors soaked for years with machine oil.
1 spark is all to took to bring down this building.

Now if you want to have an office in 1 corner and do the floor in it then go for it but a work in garage give me cement!
Dave ----

Dave, did you read the article? Caterpillar, Ford, General Electric, places all over europe use this flooring method. I highly doubt I will be spending decades soaking this floor in oil etc. Comparing Yale & Towne Manufacturing to my shop is apples and oranges.

Concrete is obviously a good choice. But I want something warm and beautiful, cheap and easy to repair.

[Gary Lewis]

That's basically what I was thinking.  Oil-soaked wood might be easier to ignite than you think.

[Ray Cecil]

Maybe I just thought inside my head, but I thought I mentioned that any paver that gets oil on it can be easily replaced.  I can also put a rubber mat down under the lift.

You guys think all these big manufacturers dont take fire hazard risk into account?

[Gary Lewis]

You did say it.  But I am judging you by myself, which isn't fair.  I spilled ATF yesterday on the same floor where I welded a few days ago, and will be welding again soon.  And I doubt I would have taken the time to replace a block.

As for GE and the others, I doubt they have welding where they have liquids like oil and gas.  But my shop isn't big enough to prevent that.

[FuzzFace2]

You did say that but why make more work for yourself and need to swap out oily wood blocks when cement is better option in my book.
You can coat cement to have different patterns and you can just wipe up a spill.

You know what they say it's your garage do as you wish.
Dave ----

[Ray Cecil]

Yeah, I wont be welding anywhere near the area I could spill oil. I dont plan to weld much at all really. If I have something to weld, I will take proper precautions.

If it works for Ford and Cat, it'll work for me.

Concrete is much more expensive. Ill spend about $6000 to put concrete in this barn, and that is only 40' x 40' of it. Still have another 40'x20'. To do the whole thing will be about $8500-$9000.

Wood pavers are free

[Ray Cecil]

Ive been organizing this morning. Fun.

[Ray Cecil]

[Gary Lewis]

Looks organized to me.  But, you need a floor!  Seriously, how would you put the wood blocks down?

[Ray Cecil]

Gary Lewis wrote

Looks organized to me.  But, you need a floor!  Seriously, how would you put the wood blocks down?

Yes. I need a floor. Traditionally, wood pavers are placed on a bed of compacted sand/clay mix. I have solid clay under the gravel. And I mean SOLID. I think my best bet is to order a load of sand, start spreading it out, and compact it with either a vibrating plate compactor, or a yard roller. Vibration would work the sand deeper, filling the spaces between the gravel, causing it to be more solid. I believe I would then take heavy mil plastic and lay it down before the blocks.

I need to run an experiment. I did one last year, and made 2x4 pavers over just sand. It worked very good. Was very stable. I need to run the same experiment with plastic underneath. The plastic is just a moisture barrier to help retard rot.

[Ray Cecil]

Hey Guys, watch this video. This is a pretty cool building technique. I wonder if I can adapt it to work for my floor.

[Gary Lewis]

Interesting!  Wood nails?  No insulation?

[Ray Cecil]

Gary Lewis wrote

Interesting!  Wood nails?  No insulation?

Not sure if you had time to watch the entire video. But it is a very well though out design. I looked up the wood species they make the nails from. Its very hard. and the Fir they use in the walls is softer than the nails.

There is no need for insulation. He said a 1" board has an R value of 1.4. So for a typical 8" wall, that is R11.2. Or an R14 for a 10" wall. The structure is much more air tight that a normal wall, so the heated air inside tends to stay inside.

This construction technique is much more practical for my garage floor. 1st, I wouldn't have to make 6560 6" x 6" x 3" thick wood pavers. I've run the calcs based upon my standard yield for a typical 10' long log. I would get about 38 6" x 6" pavers per log. That is 172 logs!!

I could easily reduce the thickness of the floor with a laminated style, 3 layer thick construction method like this one in the video. Thus reducing the total material (logs) needed. I cut 4/4 Pine boards the other day for the handrail. I believe just 2 layers of 4/4 boards would hold my lift with the biggest truck I could fit on it. Especially if I found oak or some other hardwoods to make the floor from.

Also, It is much less labor to produce a bunch of 4/4 thick boards. They literally come right off the mill. I would then stack and let air dry for a couple months. Then lay the floor. It would go down much faster than a paver floor.

Biggest downside: Lower layers, if they rot, its a pain to replace. I think I can engineer around this.

Base = clay subsoil compacted (done), 4" gravel (done), leveling sand, vapor barrier (already have enough), then two layers of 4/4 boards, or maybe 2 layers of 3/4 boards. Total thickness somewhere around 6/4 to 8/4.

Leave 2" gap around the building toe plates for expansion and contraction.

[Gary Lewis]

I watched the vast majority of it.  And I agree that slabs will be much easier than pavers - initially.  But replacing them won't be.  So the question becomes how often, if ever, you'll have to replace the flooring.

[Ray Cecil]

Gary Lewis wrote

I watched the vast majority of it.  And I agree that slabs will be much easier than pavers - initially.  But replacing them won't be.  So the question becomes how often, if ever, you'll have to replace the flooring.

YES! That is the big question. And I do believe I have in my drunken stooper tonight, engineered a way to limit the risk of rot.

[FuzzFace2]

Do they have termites over there?
Do you have them where you are?

You said you have clay as a base. when it gets wet / damp out the clay can act as a sponge from below and the top stay dry. Because of this you will get flexing of the floor with heavy weight on it.
We see it here and 1 of the reasons black top fails, flexing leads to cracks then to .....

One of the things they do here is mix cement in with the clay, add a little water to get it damp, mix it in with a large rotor tiller, roll it to compact and grade as needed. I am told they go down about a foot to mix it in so you are talking 1 foot thick concrete.
The next day in a good rain I was able to drive my 80,000 trailer truck on it with no damage.
They were doing the floor area of a wear house, concrete over it, but they also do roads this way with black top. Also have done loading dock areas too because of the weight of the trucks.
You do not need to top coat if you did not want too.
Dave ----

[Ray Cecil]

Dave, thanks for the advice.

Yes we have termites in Kentucky. They are rare, but they do exist. I plan to make the floor from Osage, Locust and cedar. All three of these will not be affected by termites.

The clay is under roof. It has been for two years now. I installed a french drain 60' long down the side of the barn that gets the wettest. The other 3 sides naturally drain away from the barn. In other words, the clay under roof will stay dry and compacted. Moisture barrier will be used also around the perimeter of the barn.

I believe I will be using some design methods from the Swiss in that youtube video I posted above.

[Ray Cecil]

Me loading logs........

[Gary Lewis]

I think you need a 460 or an IDI up front just to hold the wheels on the ground.