460 is running rich on Edelbrock 1411

[viven44]

Summit was only able to warranty for the same and barely so

[ArdWrknTrk]

I'll see when I can get by to the barn.

I know that I took it off and changed the accelerator pump. (Brass & blue I believe)

But life is very hectic for me right now.
I'm trying to be in five places at once.

[viven44]

If you find it let me know I don’t like free stuff so I’ll be paying for it

In my limited experience, getting things for almost free or a great bargain almost always has resulted in hoarding. If a fair price is paid, then it is more likely to be used.

I always have discouraged people from selling trucks or truck parts below market value, as almost often that results in using up the truck for parts or just hoarding.

[ArdWrknTrk]

It's not hoarding, if you're running it!   😈

[viven44]

I have a brand new replacement now, so I cannot blame the carburetor again

But then since the secondaries are adjustable, I am very intrigued in the 650 AVS. I will probably be trying it out... but I cannot promise that I will in the near-term. So, if I receive yours, it will go from one storage to another  for a period... Just being honest :) Maybe I'll just reach out when I'm ready, sound fair ?

[ArdWrknTrk]

I have lots of things in the barn.
I may need to rent a lift-gate van to get some of my stuff out of there.

Like I said, I'm all about paying it forward.

[viven44]

Understood and I appreciate it very much

Got the new setup in. I need to install a 90 degree 1/8 NPT adapter later for the gauge as there is only 1/4 inch clearance to the blower motor assembly. I don’t think the engine will move any  I have solid mounts, but still aesthetically it would look better.

Got all threads sealed with Loctite PST, will give it 24 hours to set and then I’ll run the electric pump and flush some gas before filling the carburetor.

[ArdWrknTrk]

That's a 750 with only single feed???

[viven44]

Yes it is the Edelbrock 1411.... that's all I could exchange it for.

Big Blue 2WD has the same exact one as well and it has plenty of torque!! I have been very happy with that.

[Gary Lewis]

I think that's the same carb I had on Big Blue, and it worked well.  

[viven44]

The new carb + fuel pressure regulator has really woken up the truck. I don't seem to have rich exhaust anymore. I can still tell when the secondaries are opening as the truck really comes to life when they do, something I have never observed in Big Blue 2WD. I wonder if the secondaries are adjusted on the old Edelbrock 1411 to come on sooner.

I do worry about the lack of a filter ahead of the regulator i.e. what if the Loctite PST 592 breaks down and gets into the carb. I did not apply it on the first 2-3 threads so it should be only towards the rear of the connectors but still I worry. The filter is located midstream.

[ArdWrknTrk]

It's literally compounded for petroleum refineries and chemical plants.  

[viven44]

Good deal then

[Gary Lewis]

Right.  There's nothing to worry about on the sealant.  It won't break down and I wouldn't have even let it set over night.  It is good to go.

But glad the new carb and the pressure regulator have sorted the problem.

As for the secondaries, I assume all the 1411's get the same weight so there's no "adjusting".  It isn't something that is easily done and only old hotrodders know how to do it - and no one wants to do it.  While the AVS can be done easily, the AFB/Performer is a pain.

[viven44]

Thanks!!

I have my eyes on the Edelbrock 650AVS now. If I can have that "extra boost" a bit earlier that would be great.

[Gary Lewis]

You can have it as early as you want.  

The conversation with Bill at Janey's therapy yesterday included about his SiL buying a double-pumper Holley.  He kept telling him the Motorcraft 4100 that was on the engine was just right, and if he wanted a Holley to get one with vacuum secondaries.  But no, he had to have a double-pumper.  Sure enough the thing fell on its face when the secondaries opened.  Put the 4100 back on and he had lots more power and no bog.

But you may be able to tune the AVS to get the boost a bit earlier than with the "AFB".  The latter is adjusted so no engine will bog, so that usually leaves something on the table.  But adjusting an AFB is no fun and is not easily reversed, so when you go too far you then have to take it back apart and put weight back on.  How much?  Enough so you don't have to take it apart again.  

[viven44]

That makes total sense. I have experienced the 'over-carbed' effect when I had my 84 Bronco with a 302. I had a Edelbrock 1405 (600CFM) on it. It definitely fell on its face when the secondaries opened and I couldn't tell when the secondaries came on, all I knew was the truck wouldn't go and pretty much the second half of the throttle was a waste and my only option was to kick-down to a lower gear to make it go   I was on the look for a 1403 (500CFM) but never got to it but advised the new owner to strongly consider that.

I am curious though, how is the accelerator pump "shot" calibrated with the timing of the secondaries opening i.e. if there is an excess "shot" and not sufficient air that creates a temporary rich condition.. My understanding is that when the secondaries open, a bigger venturi is created and the source of that fuel draw is still the bowl (?) The accelerator pump provides an immediate dose for instant gratification but I'd really like that "shot" to be timed with extra air at the same time i.e. make the secondaries come on sooner (Which we know is not possible on the manual secondaries without too much effort) or have the pump work a bit later. Those 3 holes in the pump lever control the "shot" amount, but not the timing if I understand correctly.
 

[ArdWrknTrk]

I'm planning on Thursday afternoon (with a 'real feel' of 112°F 🥵)
Don't worry.
We'll figure it out.

[Gary Lewis]

The pump shot isn't part of the equation - unless your secondaries open immediately when you floor it and that's a very rare happening.  Like you were cruising at 4000 RPM and then nailed it.

Usually you nail it and the engine revs up over a few seconds and gets to an RPM where the secondaries finally open.  But the pump shot is long gone as it only covers the brief period between when you nail it and the fraction of a second later when the fuel being pulled in via vacuum can respond.  (Air is a lot less dense and, therefore, reacts much more quickly than fuel.)

[ArdWrknTrk]

Absolutely true.
I can cite examples of orbital trajectories that are affected by low level, but not high level (say above 60k') air disturbances.