nothing special motorhome thread

[Nothing Special]

Gary Lewis wrote

....  And the golf cart is cute!  Love the Ford emblem and 4x4 sticker.

And when's the last time you saw a golf cart with a PowerStroke V8???

[Gary Lewis]

Those are rare. But one with a t-case is even more rare.

[Nothing Special]

Again a trip that got more coverage in it's own thread, but in the interest of keeping this thread complete...

A couple weeks ago we drove the motorhome down to Tennessee and Kentucky for my niece's wedding, some 'wheeling in Pluto and a bunch of other things.

On Friday we left after work, drove 300 miles in 6 hours and stayed in a rest stop in southern Wisconsin.

Saturday ended up being pretty rough!  The only problem was finding a place to park for the night, but it ended up making for a 700 mile / 14+ hour day to the Kentucky / Tennessee line.  I was really wiped out at that point.  Part of what made that longer is that the rest stop in Tennessee has almost no truck parking and was full.  There were no good options ahead, so we ended up driving about 10 miles past it to turn around and stay at the (northbound) Kentucky rest stop.

The good thing about that long day is we only had a short distance left.  We slept in and hit the road around 9:00 for a 2 hour / 70 mile drive to Windrock.  If that seems like a slow average speed, it was.  Garmin picked some interesting routes for us on this trip at times.  On this day we spent a lot of time on some VERY narrow roads through some hill towns.  It turned out that we cut about 5 miles off the drive that way.  On the way back we took real highways.

The campgound at Windrock is great if you want to be at Windrock.  Not much shade, especially considering the number of trees they must have cut down to get rid of the shade.  And pretty out-of-the-way unless you want to be there.  But nice for our purpose.



After three days of 'wheeling at Windrock, and one long rany day driving Pluto to Great Smoky Mountain National Park we broke camp and drove ~250 miles in 5+ hours to a campground near Louisville KY.  No pictures of that campground, but it was also very adequate for our needs.  We didn't spend much time there, driving Pluto for several hours every day to various things to do and people to see.

The first drive day heading home was a bit of a grind again.  After a somewhat late start we drove 450 miles in 11 hours, getting to southern Wisconsin.  The slow average pace this day was due to stopping for a nap at one point, a very nice benefit to traveling with a camper!

That left us with 300 miles in 6 hours to get home in plenty of time to get unloaded before going to work the next day.

The total trip ended up putting 2100 miles on the motorhome, with an average of 7.2 mpg, pretty close to our overall average of 7.5 mpg.

So not a real exciting post, but now this trip is logged.

[Ifitaintbroke]

Atlanta is a complete nightmare. I've lived close to Savannah most of my life and thought the people there drove crazy, but nothing could have prepared me for Atlanta. Some years back I was riding with a friend through Atlanta on the way back down from Tennessee. We were doing about 75-80 just to not get run over and people were passing us like we were standing still. Insane.

[Gary Lewis]

Those are looooong days.  Don't like doing that any more.

But you did have a great trip, so the long days were probably worth it.  

[Nothing Special]

Another little trip that I missed reporting on at the time.  Back in October we went down to southern Missouri for my third time to 'wheel with the group of old Jeeps I met on another forum.  I posted about the 'wheeling aspect of the trip at the time, but to keep this thread complete (if not timely) I'll touch on the motorhome aspects here.

Not a lot to say about it however.  Day 1 started at about 2:00 PM with an 8 hour / 415 mile drive to just north of Kansas City where we spent the night.  Day 2 was about 4.5 hours to go the last 220 miles to Rush Springs Park, the first area we 'wheeled.

After 'wheeling at Rush Springs and spending the night there we had 3 hours and about 150 miles to get to SMORR for the next three days of 'wheeling.

And then after 'wheeling on Sunday morning we drove 9 hours / 480 miles to spend the night in northern Iowa, leaving about 3.5 hours for the last 175 miles on Monday.

All of the drives were quite uneventful (hence no report right after the trip!).  But it is really nice having a nice place to sleep on a trip like this!  And a road trip in November in Lesley's car where we had to stay in a hotel reminded us of how nice it is to just pull over and sleep instead of needing to check in, find where to park, find your room and carry the luggage in.  We're continuing to like having a motorhome!

[Nothing Special]

Nothing Special wrote

....  We're continuing to like having a motorhome!

OK, it's not all sunshine and roses!  After having trouble with our generator carb getting gummed up and needing to be replaced I've been a lot more diligent in running the generator every month.  So I start the generator and turn on the isolation relay so the generator will charge both the camper battery and the van battery.  Then I shut off the isolation relay and the main power relay for the camper to avoid draining the batteries over the next month.

That went fine for November, December, January, February and March.  But when I went to start the generator in April the camper battery was stone dead.  Maybe I forgot to turn off the main power relay in March???  Oh well, no big deal, I'll just start the motorhome's engine, turn on the isolation relay and start the generator from the van battery.  But that battery is dead too!  Not stone dead, the dash lights came on.  But the starter just clicked, no crank.

So I plugged the motorhome in and charged both batteries, then ran the generator the next day.  The motorhome engine would also start.

But why did both batteries go dead this month?  They are on two completely separate electrical systems, so any problem that affected one battery wouldn't affect the other.  That is, unless the isolation relay was turned on, but it wasn't (I verified that).  Both batteries were only about a couple years old.  The camper battery has been run down pretty far before, but nothing bad ever happened to the van battery.

The only single problem I can think of that could have affected both batteries is if the camper's 110V to 12V power supply was doing something wrong when I was trying to charge both batteries off the generator in March.  Was it not charging, but somehow draining them?  But when I plugged in the motorhome in April it successfully recharged both batteries.  Or was it overcharging and boiled the batteries?  I guess I can't rule that out.  I still don't know what happened.

I am thinking about putting some manual isolation switches on rather than the relays.  But it doesn't seem like that would solve everything.  Oh well, like people say, the more spark plugs you own the more complicated your life is.

[Gary Lewis]

Bummer!  Do you have a load tester?  If the batteries have been damaged that should tell you.  Or, what's the voltage a few hours after charging?  Does it stay close to 12.8?

What kind of relays do you have?  Not sure I understand the way it is wired.  But I like the Cole Hersee smart isolators as they seem to do the job w/o muss or fuss.

[Nothing Special]

I do not have a load tester.  And I blew the fuse on my multi-meter the last time I tried using it.  I just fixed it today, but I haven't had a chance to check the voltage yet.


To better explain the system...

There are two separate 12V electrical systems: the camper and the van.  The van system is just what came from Ford, with a single battery and the alternator to charge it.  The camper system is the lights, water pump, smoke CO and propane detectors, furnace blower and vent fan.  There's room for two batteries, but I only have one.  And there's a 12V power supply that runs off 110V AC to run all of those things and charge the battery any time the camper is plugged in or any time the 110V generator is running.

There's a shut-off relay that disconnects the camper battery from the camper electrical system.  This keeps the camper from running down its battery during storage.  However I believe it does draw power all the time it's turned on.

Additionally there's an isolation relay that can connect the van electrical system to the camper battery.  There's a SPDT on-off-on switch that powers it.  In one "on" position it draws power from the van battery through an oil pressure switch.  When the switch is in this position it automatically connects the batteries any time the engine has oil pressure, meaning any time it's running.  This is the position I have the switch almost all of the time, so the batteries are isolated when the engine is off, but connected when it's running so the van alternator can charge the camper battery.

In the other "on" position the isolation relay draws power directly from the camper battery, so the batteries are connected any time the switch is in this position.  I could use this position for jump-starting the van from the camper, but the main use is to allow the camper power supply to charge the van battery when I periodically run the generator while the motorhome is being stored.

[Gary Lewis]

I think I understand.  And I agree that the shut-off relay that disconnects the camper battery from the camper system uses power when it is on, but I'd hope that "on" is when the camper battery is connected to the camper system.

And the relay that is powered by oil pressure in one position of the switch is doing roughly what my battery isolator relay does, only yours doesn't take power when the relay is off, and mine does as it has a circuit watching the voltage to determine when to come in.  So I like yours - a lot.

So the question will be what the voltages are on the batteries when they have no load on them but have been fully charged.

[Nothing Special]

Gary Lewis wrote

I think I understand.  And I agree that the shut-off relay that disconnects the camper battery from the camper system uses power when it is on, but I'd hope that "on" is when the camper battery is connected to the camper system.

Yes, that's what I meant.  But I realized re-reading my post that it sort of does read that it draws power when the relay is on, shutting the battery off.  That's not what I meant though.  Relay on to connect battery to camper, relay off to shut it down.

Gary Lewis wrote

....  So the question will be what the voltages are on the batteries when they have no load on them but have been fully charged.

I might check that today.  But it's raining, so I might not either!

[Nothing Special]

I put a voltmeter on the batteries this weekend.  This was about 2 weeks after they were last charged (and I didn't check what they were when they were being charged).  The camper battery was at 12.6V and the van battery was at 12.2V.  The 12.2 seems low to me, and I might need to replace that battery soon.  But I think the next thing will be to see what voltage the batteries are getting when the 110V power supply is plugged in.  If that's too high or too low I'll need to get that looked at.  But that'll wait a couple weeks until the next time I'm running the generator.


In other news, last fall when I was winterizing the motorhome I noticed I had a leak between the gray tank and the drain valves.  I pulled it apart then, and over the winter I went to a Camping World and got the sealant they recommended, but figured I shouldn't try to use it when it was cold.  On Saturday we got into the 80s, so it was a perfect time for a little motorhome maintenance.

Nothing really to report at this point other than it's back together.  I'll have to wait until there's water in it to see if there's any leak.

[Gary Lewis]

12.6 might be ok, but 12.2 isn't - assuming there isn't load on either battery.

You might want to check to see if you have much in the way of dark current by placing your DVM in the 200ma mode and placing it between the positive post and the positive cable.  However, a number of the systems on Big Blue have fairly high current in startup mode, so I like to connect the DVM before disconnecting the battery cable so there isn't any startup mode.

[Nothing Special]

Time to run the generator again.  I checked the camper battery before trying to start the generator and it was at 12.4V.  This was after sitting for about a month after being charged.

That was enough juice to start the generator.  I checked the battery voltage with the generator running and it was about 13.4 at first, and was up to 13.56 after about half an hour.  So it doesn't look like my power supply is over-charging the batteries.

I checked the camper battery again right after shutting the generator off and it was at 12.8V.

The camper battery is a deep cycle battery, so I'm not going to worry too much about it.  And about the worst thing that happens if it won't hold a charge long is that the furnace shuts off in the middle of the night when we're stopped on the road.  But I don't expect to need the furnace in the next few trips, so even more reason to not worry.

I'm a little more concerned about the starting battery in the van.  I didn't check it this weekend, but starting batteries never like being run low.  I'll be getting the motorhome out of storage in a few weeks to get ready for the next trip, and I'll look closer at that battery then.  It might get replaced soon.

[Gary Lewis]

12.4V isn't bad at all after all that time.  And it started the generator nicely I take it?

And 13.4 initially and 13.56 is good in that it shows the generator is charging but not overcharging the battery.

As for the starting battery, a new one would be peace of mind but also might be expensive.  Maybe have it load tested at the local parts store?

But getting the motorhome out "in a few weeks" sounds like you are pretty sure it is in good shape.  I'm in the middle of shake-down cruises, parts replacements, tune ups, lube jobs, etc.  

[Nothing Special]

It was in good shape when I parked it last fall.  And I did start it a month ago.  So I figure giving a couple of weeks in case there are any surprises isn't a bad idea, but if I give it much more than that I'm as likely to have new surprises pop up as I am to have old ones to deal with.  Or at least that's what I'm telling myself.  I am driving Pluto a bunch this month though!

As for the batteries, even with a fully charged camper battery the generator kind of starts to crank, then bogs out, then finally cranks over pretty good.  And then it needs to crank for at least 10 - 15 seconds before there's ANY attempt to fire.  That's what it did this weekend.  So I don't know that I'd say it started nicely, but no worse than typical.  And if the motorhome starts on it's own when I uncover it in a few weeks I'll leave the battery alone for now.  And even if it doesn't I'm not sure I'll do anything with it yet.  If the camper battery is holding a charge it's just flipping a switch to let it jump start itself.  And worst case is I disconnect Pluto and pull him around to jump start it.  So I won't be stranded.

[Gary Lewis]

Nothing Special wrote

So I figure giving a couple of weeks in case there are any surprises isn't a bad idea, but if I give it much more than that I'm as likely to have new surprises pop up as I am to have old ones to deal with.

Parkinson's Law: Work expands to fill the time allowed.  

Yes, I understand driving Pluto a bunch.  Big Blue is getting the same treatment.  Speaking of which, it is time to finish the cup of French Roast and start on the AFR meter wiring.  

[Nothing Special]

As I said in mat's "opinions on a motorhome" thread, while I like traveling in a motorhome, if I didn't need it to bring Pluto I'd prefer to pull a travel trailer with my truck and not have to deal with another truck that only gets driven a few times a year.

The van battery was rather low after a month (~12.2V), but it cranked over the engine fine, and it started as quickly as ever.  That's the good news.

But the radio didn't come on.  No lights on the face.  Nothing.  Lesley tells me that it's going to be a long drive (for me!) out to Utah if she doesn't have a radio to sing along to!  So last night I checked fuses (all good), and then pulled it out and tried checking the power.

Removing the dash to remove the radio is a pain.  But I got the radio out.  I couldn't figure the rats nest of wiring out, so I left it apart while I found the wiring diagram.  But by then it was dark out.

So this evening I went out to try again.  But now it's stone dead.  The battery reads about 6V and nothing lights up on the dash when I turn the key on.

There was something clicking when I opened the door.  I couldn't figure out what it was, it's somewhere in front of the driver.

Anyway, it's on a battery charger now.  I need to figure out what's causing the drain.  And now that this battery's been drained at least twice it needs to be replaced.

Ah, the fun of another truck that never gets used!

[Gary Lewis]

I've seen trucks pulling travel trailers and vehicles.  Not that I'd want to do it, but...

Still, I agree that keeping that many vehicles up to snuff ain't fun.  So I understand the pain.  The boat was much like that.

The clicking noise is obviously odd.  To figure out what that is you might get lucky by pulling fuses one at a time.  But that won't really help you find the drain.  I have a fuse replacement/ammeter like this one from Amazon, and it works nicely to check the draw on each fuse.  Mine actually came from Harbor Freight, but it looks a lot like that one from Amazon.

Good luck!

[Nothing Special]

In some states, Minnesota included*, you can't legally pull a trailer AND tow a vehicle.  So I'm limited to a motorhome that can tow Pluto, or a BIG toy-hauler fifth-wheel that could carry Pluto inside.  I guess those exist, but even the biggest ones I've seen, that are still too small to carry Pluto, need at least an F-450 to tow them.  So I'm back to needing another truck that's just used on vacations.

Well, OK, I could go the redneck toy-hauler route: get a big gooseneck trailer and strap a slide-in camper to the front and park Pluto on the back.  But Lesley vetoes that idea!


*  Minnesota's laws about towing multiple trailers are weird.  You can tow a trailer behind a fith-wheel behind a pickup.  But the second trailer needs to be carrying a limited number of things.  Boats, motorcycles and ATVs are allowed, but a car (or Bronco) isn't.  The really odd thing about the law is that if you have an ATV on the second trailer you're legal, but if you unload the ATV and put something else on the same trailer you're not legal.  It makes no sense, but it doesn't have to make sense to still get you in trouble.