No Brake Lights/Hazard Lights

[Machspeed]

Hey Fellas, I was mess'in with my lights today and noted that I had no brake lights. Further checking noted I had no hazard lights. All other lights work. Is there an electrical relationship between the brake and hazard lights? If the flasher was bad, would the brake lights also fail to come on?  

I pulled the flasher and took it in to AZ and the guy told me it was no longer available and that I would have to acquire one at a salvage yard.....WHAT!!! Tried to locate one at RockAuto but either I'm entering the wrong nomenclature or the AZ rep was correct.

 

[kramttocs]

The first relationship is the fuse so I'd check that to ensure it's good. The second is the Hazard/Turn Signal Switch.

http://www.garysgaragemahal.com/turn-stop--hazard-lamps.html

I am going to assume the parts guy was purely looking at the number on the yours and not using logic. You just need a round, 2 pin flasher.
For example: Standard  EFL552

If you are going to leds you'll need one like United Pacific LED Flashers 90650

[Machspeed]

Thanks for the response and the wiring schematic, Scott. I don't know why but I have such a bad time finding things. I need to study the website better. The fuse is good, first thing I checked. Probably the turn signal switch, which I need to replace anyway. While the turn signals work, I need to hold down for a right hand turn. Gonna look at the smaller individual things first....i.e. brake switch.  

[ArdWrknTrk]

If it were the flasher OR the brake switch you wouldn't lose both.

The fuse and the turn switch are the only things common to both.

[old55pete]

John, it sounds alot like you need to bite the bullet and replace the turn signal switch. The reason I am saying that is that the brake lights are wired through the turn signal switch. When you push the lever down for the left turn signal, it canceles  the left brake light and makes it flash for the signal. Same with the flashers, it was mandated that the flashers were to be on their own or seperate circute, hence the reason you have two flasher relays. All of this goes through the turn signal switch and out to the lights.

This is just my humble opnion and by all means, do all of the trouble shooting you think you need to do because changing the turn signal switch is a major PITA

[Machspeed]

old55pete wrote

John, it sounds alot like you need to bite the bullet and replace the turn signal switch. The reason I am saying that is that the brake lights are wired through the turn signal switch. When you push the lever down for the left turn signal, it canceles  the left brake light and makes it flash for the signal. Same with the flashers, it was mandated that the flashers were to be on their own or seperate circute, hence the reason you have two flasher relays. All of this goes through the turn signal switch and out to the lights.

This is just my humble opnion and by all means, do all of the trouble shooting you think you need to do because changing the turn signal switch is a major PITA

Agree Steve, I'm in denial......arghhh! Indeed, I've read that the replacement is a PITA. I wished I had caught this when I had most of the dash out in the blend door repair.

Recommendations for replacement switch and procedure?

[ArdWrknTrk]

I've been told the Doorman one is crap, but mine has been fine for over a decade.

Procedure?
What is there to pulling off the steering wheel?

[old55pete]

John, I have found that between six to eight wraps of det cord will in fact take it apart in seconds. The problem is finding all of the parts to put it back together.

The best way for me is to remove the steering wheel first, then take the colum out of the pickup and put it in a bench vice. Then start taking it apart. Cutting the plug off of the wires helps to get the wires out and gives you a wiring diagram to put it back together. Tape a piece of safety wire to the old wires and pull it through the housing when you pull out the old switch. That way you can tape it to the new wires to help pull them through the colum when you put the new switch in.

[Machspeed]

Jim, I suspect you spliced into the existing switch rather than replace the whole switch. Am I correct in that?

[ArdWrknTrk]

Perhaps my '87 is far different?

I only had to unpin one wire in the connector.

I used the old wire to pull the new one through.

[Machspeed]

I can tell already, this is going to be one of those deals where fixing this leads to messing with other things. You know, while you're there, might as well blah, blah, blah.....

A month or so ago, I had to fix an intake leak that lead to water pump, timing chain/gear, power steering pump, fuel pump, thermostat, plug/plug wires, hoses, belts replacement. Not to mention carb and distributor rebuild......arghhh! Makes me tired thinking about it.    

[kramttocs]

I reinstalled mine after doing a restore on the column so full disclosure that it was on the table and no contortions required but I it really shouldn't be bad. I wouldn't bother splicing the wires.

No doubt there is a guide somewhere but just going over it mentally, here is how I'd go about it:

1. Unhook battery
2. Remove the connector at the base of the column from that little standoff piece that holds it to the ignition switch (not to be confused with the key/tumbler near the wheel at the top of the column)
3. Disconnect the connector from the truck harness
4. Cut the wires (assuming no need to save them)
5. Tape the ends together with a string on them
6. Remove steering wheel, remove screws for the switch and pull the switch out and thus the wiring/string also
7. Remove the string but don't let it fall back down
8. On the new switch, make notes/photos of the wiring order in the connector. If the colors match the old, now amputated connector you can just use it for reference
9. Remove the red retainer in the connector and pull all the wires/terminals out by prying the locking tab away with a small flat screwdriver
10. Tape the wires all together along with the string
11. Feed/Pull the wires along the same path as the string until the switch is seated
12. Reinstall the screws for the switch
13. Reinstall the connector at the bottom according to your notes/photos
14. Connect the connector to the truck harness and remount on the standoff
15. Finish up installing the steering wheel (loosely until confirmed working), reconnect battery, test


Anyone feel free to correct something I may have left out/overlooked/misremembered.

I do like Steve's disassembly approach better though- would save a lot of steps

[Machspeed]

Looking at the replacement part for my tilt wheel at RockAuto here: https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/ford,1986,f-150,5.8l+351cid+v8,1121678,electrical-switch+&+relay,turn+signal+switch,4832

They show a unit from She-Marr and it states "One spring pin design (replaces two pin design)". It is cheaper, probably Chinese. But, what's this one spring thing all about?

Comparatively, I was looking at a more expensive option from SMP but no mention of this pin design thing. I just want a quality product that will last and keep me out of that steering column for awhile. What would you guys go with?    


 

[kramttocs]

I am not sure on the spring pin difference but when it comes to electrical pieces, if I see the 'Standard' brand I usually go with it. No experience with She-Marr.

[ArdWrknTrk]

I wouldn't try to save under $10 (25%) to have something that looks that cheesy.

Because, like you said, I wouldn't want to do it again.

Same thing with my transfer case.
I bought the SKF bearing and seal kit.
(and I replaced the expensive chain)
because I don't have time to be broken down.

[ArdWrknTrk]

I guess the only place where I differed is that I cut the wires at the switch and used one of them to fish the harness down.

(Disclosure) I do not have tilt, so IDK how that differs.

[Machspeed]

Yeah, gonna spend a little more and get the better unit. Was really just curious about the pin design thing.

Great resource for the column that I'm putting here, as I suck at finding things here....LOL! This was your disassembly, Scott.  

http://www.garysgaragemahal.com/#nabble-td41757

[kramttocs]

Curious on that as well.

Are you going real deep in the column or just replacing the switch?
If the former, Gary has the manual here and there is a tab with my assembly instructions if helpful.

http://www.garysgaragemahal.com/steering-columns1.html

[old55pete]

Scott, like you, I find it way easer to do it on a bench. It makes it easer on my worn out shoulders, neck, back. On the bench or in a vice, it takes all of the fight and contortions out of it. It does add the time of removing the colum but in the long run, the extra time is worth it, that and not looking like Stephen Hawikns for two or three days.

[myrl883]

I have a big preference for OEM parts. They're out there, I just need to know if you have a tilt or fixed column. If it's a fixed column, you may have to go aftermarket... sorry 'bout that.