Choke Question, what would you do?

[LARIAT 85]

FuzzFace2 wrote

So other than the tubing being wrapped around the manifold it is run just like the factory.
Bill, I did buy that kit. Dorman makes one and I used the sleve from it. I did not want to have it pull "dirty" air if I used that metal half bucket thing and why I went with the wrapping.

I also checked if the hot air tube is getting heat and it is it just took some time for the heat to make it to the carb choke area.
I think I am going to try and add a few more loops around the manifold to get more heat to see if that helps any.

Did you read my post?  

The aftermarket choke stove kit works great on Lucille, and I didn't have to wrap the copper wire around and around the header.  The "half bucket" acts as a hot air chamber to solve the problem you are having.

You do not have to pull "dirty" air if you simply drill another hole on the other end of the "half bucket" and route the tube back up to the fresh air port on the carburetor. That will be much simpler, neater, and more effective than the way you are doing it.

[FuzzFace2]

LARIAT 85 wrote

FuzzFace2 wrote

So other than the tubing being wrapped around the manifold it is run just like the factory.
Bill, I did buy that kit. Dorman makes one and I used the sleve from it. I did not want to have it pull "dirty" air if I used that metal half bucket thing and why I went with the wrapping.

I also checked if the hot air tube is getting heat and it is it just took some time for the heat to make it to the carb choke area.
I think I am going to try and add a few more loops around the manifold to get more heat to see if that helps any.

Did you read my post?  

The aftermarket choke stove kit works great on Lucille, and I didn't have to wrap the copper wire around and around the header.  The "half bucket" acts as a hot air chamber to solve the problem you are having.

You do not have to pull "dirty" air if you simply drill another hole on the other end of the "half bucket" and route the tube back up to the fresh air port on the carburetor. That will be much simpler, neater, and more effective than the way you are doing it.

I did but on the EFI manifolds there is not really any where to mount it.
I also think the loops around the manifold would be getting more heat than that half can and the tube passing through it.

I needed to pick up a new oil psi sender and when at the parts store picked up some header wrap.
I will make a few more wraps of copper and them the header wrap to keep the heat in.

And dont you know this week its going to be in the 70's and dont need a choke
Dave ----

[LARIAT 85]

FuzzFace2 wrote

I also think the loops around the manifold would be getting more heat than that half can and the tube passing through it.

Dave ----

I think you are obviously wrong.
 
You have a problem with your choke not getting hot enough with numerous loops around the manifold.  

I do not have this problem at all, and I am running the Choke Stove kit with the half can and tube passing through it.


But hey, good luck.  Maybe you will hit on the magic number of loops around your manifold to finally get the choke hot enough to work correctly.

[FuzzFace2]

Is that on a 300 six with EFI exh manifolds?

I will have to find where I put the kit and give it a try and see.
I think its where the rest of the copper tubing is

I wont have time till most likely Sunday to look for them and maybe make any changes if I have the time.
It is also going to be in the 70's and the choke works good at that temp.
Dave ----

[LARIAT 85]

FuzzFace2 wrote

Is that on a 300 six with EFI exh manifolds?

I will have to find where I put the kit and give it a try and see.
I think its where the rest of the copper tubing is

I wont have time till most likely Sunday to look for them and maybe make any changes if I have the time.
It is also going to be in the 70's and the choke works good at that temp.
Dave ----

No, mine is on a 5.0 with ceramic coated Tri-Y headers.

I think the copper tubing out in the open may also be part of your problem.  Copper heats up fast, but it also loses heat faster than aluminum.  The [aluminum] choke stove "dome" in the kit will help the copper tubing retain heat.  And the insulated hot air tube sleeve will help keep it hot until it reaches the choke cap.

[rcarlisle]

I used Lariat's idea of inlet/outlet tubes on the dorman piece.  I have 302 with stock manifolds and plugged hot air boss.   SO I bought the Dorman piece, drilled the second end.   In that I packed the OEM metal filter material someone recommended here.   Then installed tubes in each end and routed them up to the carb.  

The Dorman bucket piece is hose clamped to the passenger exhaust down pipe as the instructions offer.  It's so far down you can't see anything but my poor attempt at tube forming coming up from down behind engine.   I also had to buy copper tube as the aluminum won't stand up to much hard handling.    

If you want to try that, it doesn't have to go on manifold and can be set up to pull the air flow all the way through from the filtered air at carb top.  I don't have any good photos and probably won't help with your 6 anyway.  But it does seem to work correctly.

[edit] after reading through again, I'm just not sure there isn't something else happening though.  Your reasoning and routing with the copper tubing seems pretty solid to me.   Does your choke cap end of copper tubing have some vacuum to draw the heat through?  Seems like the 2150 has a provision for a bit of vacuum to help draw the hot air in.  

[85lebaront2]

Randy, all hot air chokes have a vacuum passage internally to pull the air through. The water heated ones still will have a choke pull-off, either an internal piston or a diaphragm that can be internal or external.

[rcarlisle]

ok, good to know - thanks.

[FuzzFace2]

LARIAT 85 wrote

FuzzFace2 wrote

Is that on a 300 six with EFI exh manifolds?

I will have to find where I put the kit and give it a try and see.
I think its where the rest of the copper tubing is

I wont have time till most likely Sunday to look for them and maybe make any changes if I have the time.
It is also going to be in the 70's and the choke works good at that temp.
Dave ----

No, mine is on a 5.0 with ceramic coated Tri-Y headers.

I think the copper tubing out in the open may also be part of your problem.  Copper heats up fast, but it also loses heat faster than aluminum.  The [aluminum] choke stove "dome" in the kit will help the copper tubing retain heat.  And the insulated hot air tube sleeve will help keep it hot until it reaches the choke cap.

I do have the insulated sleeve on the hot side of the tube.
Think one of the pictures shows it.

rcarlisle wrote

[edit] after reading through again, I'm just not sure there isn't something else happening though.  Your reasoning and routing with the copper tubing seems pretty solid to me.   Does your choke cap end of copper tubing have some vacuum to draw the heat through?  Seems like the 2150 has a provision for a bit of vacuum to help draw the hot air in.

When I was checking it fast the last time it was pulling a vacuum it just took a long time for the heat to reach the choke.

I did buy some header wrap the other day but I have to check into this more.
I did lean it out last time and that helped a little but it also got warm.
Tomorrow its going to be the last day in the 70's before getting cool again (50's & 60's) for the next week so I dont know if I do anything will help when it gets down below 45*?
Dave ----

[Tarheel Blue]

Dave,
In that pile of YFA stuff that I gave you the other day, wasn’t there an electric choke cap?
If not, I have one on my shelf.

[FuzzFace2]

Tarheel Blue wrote

Dave,
In that pile of YFA stuff that I gave you the other day, wasn’t there an electric choke cap?
If not, I have one on my shelf.

There might be and I meant to look to see what all is in the box as I have yet to do that
But I have an up date:

I spent some time on the choke today.
I wanted to swap the temp sensor in the air filter that works the snout hot air valve.
I did that but I think the valve is no good as I have vacuum at the valve  

I routed the cold air side of the hot air asst. in close to the motor & manifolds.
I think with it kind of out it the open it was getting too cold and any heat picked up after that point was just not enough.

I was going to add to the copper and make a few more loops around the exh manifold but I did not have a good way to join more tubing to what was on the truck but ..........

I picked up header wrap the other day and wrapped 7.5 feet of 15 feet around the manifold and tubing.
I can tell you the hot air tube dose get HOT at the choke so I am happy on that.
In testing the tube was getting hot and so was the electric cap as I could feel that getting hot so both are working as they should.

I also know the choke is opening all the way even before I started the mods as I had the air filter off as I was checking for oil leak after I changed the oil PSI sender.
It was also 70*f out and the choked worked good if the temp was above 45*f, I just dont know when it may get below that temp again for testing?

So till it gets cold again I will be using the truck as it is now.
Dave ----

[Gary Lewis]

Good luck.  Hopefully this solved your problem.  

[FuzzFace2]

Me too.
I could not test it this morning as I left the truck at work and brought home the work truck with a load that had to be delivered at 7am 3 hours away.
It also was still to warm buts Temps are dropping.
Dave  ----

[Gary Lewis]

Temps are DROPPING!  It is 26F here this morn.

[Les Kerf]

I have used the copper tubing wrapped around the EFI manifold on a300-6 for years with good results; I also use the stock Ford electric choke connected to the stator. I am a firm believer in having ALL of the stock air cleaner system in place and fully funtional on a 300-6 with a Carter YF carb. I have never been able to obtain best results without it.

Whenever possible, I like to adjust the choke on a nice 70 degree day with a stone-cold engine (not having been started since the day before) and have it not quite, but almost, close the choke butterfly; this seems to give me the best results.
YMMV.
Good luck!

[FuzzFace2]

Les Kerf wrote

I have used the copper tubing wrapped around the EFI manifold on a300-6 for years with good results; I also use the stock Ford electric choke connected to the stator. I am a firm believer in having ALL of the stock air cleaner system in place and fully funtional on a 300-6 with a Carter YF carb. I have never been able to obtain best results without it.

Whenever possible, I like to adjust the choke on a nice 70 degree day with a stone-cold engine (not having been started since the day before) and have it not quite, but almost, close the choke butterfly; this seems to give me the best results.
YMMV.
Good luck!

Thanks Les
I am still fixing the air filter side as I just found it was not working as it should.
It may be a bit before it gets below 45° here.
Next few days lows are about mid 40's mid to high 50's during the day Saturday going to be mid 70's
Will keep posted what happens.
Dave. ----

[FuzzFace2]

Well it was 28°f when I left for work today.
Normally truck is parked in the house garage, unheated. I start it with 1 pump not even to the floor to set the choke and it fires right up.
I back it out and let it run as I grab the rest of my work stuff and hit the John 1 last time, old man here LOL

When I get out to the truck the the fast idle goes from about 1000 rpm to about 1200 rpm, 1 tap of the pedal and it dropped to about 800 rpm, normal speed.
I was able to dive it like it was up to full temp even if it was not and the idle speed stayed low at the light 1/4 mile up the road.

I took back roads o ly because of the time, rust hour and highway is stop & go most of the way.
I got to say the choke stayed open for the whole drive, just under 40 miles.

I would say leaning out the choke and wrapping the tubes & manifold with header wrap to keep the heat in did the trick.
I still would like to get the snorkel valve work at some point but has dropped down the list some.

Still testing but might be as good as it gets.
Dave  ----

[Gary Lewis]

Sounds like you got pretty close.   

[rcarlisle]

Sounding better.   Going through that myself with my 302.  

[FuzzFace2]

Gary Lewis wrote

Sounds like you got pretty close.  

Or got lucky
Took to work again today, 1am 34°f and worked great.
I need to find time to look into the pinging at load. Still have a little with vacuum disconnected & plugged.
Dave  ----