C6 to E4OD swap

[ReneH]

Ok. Sounds good.

So I can use one of this ECUs?


Back again to my question regarding the timeline:

1. Buy the E4OD
Currently the seller offers me the transmission for 750 euro. Maybe I'll get him down to 700 euro including shipping.
Is this a good price for a used E4OD? I have no reference here. It's the only available currently...

2. Overhaul the E4OD
Complete teardown and rebuild.

3. Care about the rest
Let rework the driveshafts
Buy an EEC-V
Rework the crossmember

4. Installation
After I have done everything, that I can do without removing my C6, the Installation of all prepared parts an start.

[85lebaront2]

Rene' sounds reasonable to me. As for the EEC-V box, you are going to probably ending up reflashing it for your vehicle and driving style. It will learn as you drive, however, disconnecting the battery will give it amnesia (ask Gary about that).

I have a list of compatible EECs, what you are looking for is a code on the label, ML1-441 that is an E4OD capable EEC. Gary can use the ML1-442 which is MT or C6 compatible (basically any non-computer controlled transmission).

Your engine at 347 ci would take a 351 MAF, which is a 80mm OD unit, I have one I was sold as being for a 460 and really can't use it.

I have a 351/E4OD EEC-V that I have not reflashed, it was given to me by one of my son's neighbors in West Virginia. It is for a 351/E4OD from an E-series (Ford full size van). The only initial item you might have to do would be change the firing order if your engine is still using the 1986 302 sequence (15426378) insread of (13726548). This is done during the reflash.

[ReneH]

Hi Bill,

So if I understand you right, you can sell me the ECU as also the MAF?

I'm already using a 351W ECU and also the stock 351W CAM. So my firing order is also changed to 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8.

Nobody has given me a hint about the price for the E4OD. I have the seller now down to 700 euro. I think this is an acceptable price as I don't have much alternatives over here.

[Pete Whitstone]

ReneH wrote

Nobody has given me a hint about the price for the E4OD. I have the seller now down to 700 euro. I think this is an acceptable price as I don't have much alternatives over here.

700 euro, or about $749 USD, I would find to be an acceptable price for a transmission being sold as a good working unit. A bit on the high side, perhaps.

If the transmission is being sold as a rebuildable core (non-working or unknown condition), then that price would be very high. I see E4ODs in unknown condition typically being sold here (Texas, USA) for about $100-$300.

But I don't really know what the German market for used automotive parts looks like, or what the prices should be. I can only tell you what I see here.

But if it's the only one available, and you want it, it's kind of a sellers market.

[85lebaront2]

Yes, if you want them, I assume I would ship them to your forwarder in Florida?

[ReneH]

Yes, the problem over here is, that we do not have junkyards, anymore. You have no luck to find used parts for a small amount of money, if you are able to overhaul them.

The next problem is, that in Germany not as much American cars running as in the USA.

I have already bought it, cause I don't know, when I'll get the next chance.

[ReneH]

Ok Bill,

Yes, I'm interested. But we can wait until I'm back from holidays. Before it, I will have to time to change the transmission or something else.

The only thing I have planned is to overhaul the transfer case. I've bought a complete rebuild set with bearings, seals and also the chain.

[85lebaront2]

No problem.

Here are pictures of the MAF, disregard the yellow lettering, it was wrong. This does not have the air temperature sensor built in, it used one in the side of the air filter housing. One item for you, ALL the air going into the engine must pass through the MAF, this includes the air going into the valve cover breather for the PCV system.




Here are a couple of pictures of the EEC-V box. You will need a 104 pin connector for it and it takes some very small female sockets for the pins.

[ReneH]

Ok, looks good.

Do you also have the connector case for the EEC-V and the crimp pins?

Regarding the MAF:
It's not an in-line type. Where will it be fixed?
Airfliter-box?

As I currently use a single filter on the valve-cover, I will have to remove it and connect a hose again from the valve cover ending before the MAF.

The ACT stays then still in the intake mainfold?!

As I plan to use the Holley HIGH-RAM EFI intake mainfold, I'll switch also to a single 95mm or 105mm throttle body.
I still have to check, if the front or the side position of the throttle body fits better to my engine layout.

[85lebaront2]

Rene', here is a picture of a 460 MAF setup:

The picture is from the back side of the air cleaner assembly.

I do not have an extra 104 pin EEC connector, I do have a bunch of the female pins for the smaller EEC pins in the 104 pin plug. Possibly Rock Auto may have a service plug which would come with the pins.

A few other items, the EEC-V system originally used 3 O2 sensors, one for each bank, and the 3rd on was behind the catalytic converter to determine if it was functioning correctly. On my system and Gary's the 3rd O2 sensor, catalyst overheat sensor, misfire detector amoung others are disabled in the software.

The beauty of the EEC-V is once the "programming lock" is defeated, you can change the program (called a tune) any time you want. As gary found out, disconnecting the battery gives the computer amnesia, and it takes a bit of driving for it to "relearn".

[ReneH]

Ok. I have to think about my setup, as I use an open airfilter/cold air intake. But I will find a solution for this.

Has the ACT also to be before the MAF, or is the ACT mounted in the mainfold as good as before the MAF?

Good tip for the O2 sensors! As I already have to rework my exhaust on the driver's side, I will look, if I find a position in the downpipe and install the thread for the sensor. My current O2 sensor is located in the downpipe on the passenger side.

Do you have the part-numbers for the connector and the pins?
My last connector for the EEC-IV, I was only able to get from ebay...

[85lebaront2]

Rene', air temperature can be left in the intake, or relocated to the air filter housing. I prefer there so it isn't affected by engine heat. I was right in the middle of trying to find a good source for the 104 pin plug.

Here's one: https://www.ebay.com/itm/143162893026

Another one: https://www.ebay.com/itm/364222790867

Next time I visit one of my two favorite salvage yards I can grab one with as much of the harness as possible. It may be a while though.

[ReneH]

Thanks Bill!

I'll take a look at them.

Please don't bother about a connector from the salvage yard...as I use double insulated cables, I need the housing and the pins.

I'm also thinking about to relocate the ECU into the former glove compartment. I still have to estimate, if there will be enough space for my new "electrical center", when I do the complete re-wiring of all non-engine cables. But that's another point.

[85lebaront2]

Ok, I won't worry about that. On the computer location, the EEC-V box is the same size as the EEC-IV, Gary has his in the orignal 1985/86 mount under the dash and ran the engine harness through the original hole in the 1985/86 firewall.

[Gary Lewis]

Yep.  But the EEC-V harness is only long enough to get it to the left kick panel, so I added about 36" of wire in the harness on all 50 or so connections.

[ReneH]

I have planed the movement of the ECU not because of too less space on the original position. I've planned it to get more comfort, when working on it.

I like to restructure things, to get easier access for maintenance.

[Gary Lewis]

There's not much maintenance on the ECU.  If it goes bad you replace it, and in the Bullnose position you loosen a screw, swivel the keeper out of the way, and wiggle the ECU out of the connector.

But there can be programming of an EEC-V ECU, and that is done via the OBD-II port, which you get to determine where to mount.  I put mine near the ECU, roughly above the throttle pedal in a fairly stock position for newer vehicles.

[85lebaront2]

Rene', I just went through my MAF collection and remembered someting I had done. I got some from junkyards and bought a couple on eBay. One of those was sold as coming from a 1999 F150 5.4L V8. When I received it I noticed the part number on the actual sensor part was a 1995 number F5OF-12B579-AA then AFH80-01A. When I received it I found it was 80mm in diameter rather than 90mm.

One of my 90mm units had the same sensor on it, just with a different date code. The 90mm wouldn't run properly on Darth, missfiring, almost no throttle response so I put it aside. When I received the mislabeled 80mm unit I found it had the same sensor, so I tried switching them and the 90mm one now worked perfectly. I just reinstalled the original sensor on the 80mm unit and it now responds as it should to air flow through it.

When you return from Holidays, we can set up shipping. You can probably plug everything in and get it to start up and run, you will get some error codes, like no 3rd O2 sensor, no misfire detector, all of which can be turned off in the software. I use a syetm called "Binary Editor" supplied by Core Tunning LLC, Gary found another that has some better features called "Tuner Pro" and "Tuner Pro RT" one of it's features is the ability to keep the torque converter clutch engaged on deceleration for better coasting control going down hills or mountains, or in my case, going downhill it the tunnels on one of the seven man made wonders of the world, the Chesapeake Bay Bridge-Tunnel.

I put my OBD-II connector where Ford had it on the 1996/7 F250HD and F350 trucks:

[Gary Lewis]

I'm following along.  But are you going to do the Binary Editor work for Rene?  That's a steep learning curve, so I plan on doing it for Steve/FoxFord33, but he is local and will be looking over my shoulder or I his.

[85lebaront2]

I was thinking you might want to follow up on Tuner Pro with him, it might be easier for him to learn. I will be sending him an 80mm MAF (correct size for 302/351 applications) and an EEC-V from an E250 351 and E4OD. It will probably start up and run for him but will set some codes. His 347ci is close enough to 351ci for it to at least start and run so he will have that satisfaction immediately.